EU politics

[thedarkproject]

I'll be quite glad if the whole European Union project goes belly-up as a result of all the recent wrangling. We have the current EU president saying that the constitution will not be renegotiated - despite France and Holland, quite important countries, voting against it - and in fact claiming that "I really believe neither the French nor the Dutch rejected the constitutional treaty".

Now, as I understand it, the wording of the French referendum was "Approuvez-vous le projet de loi qui autorise la ratification du traité établissant une Constitution pour l'Europe? " which is essentially, 'do you approve of the bill authorising the ratification of the European constitution?' The Dutch version was "Bent U voor of tegen instemming door Nederland met het verdrag tot vaststelling van een grondwet voor Europa?" which Wikipedia tells me means "Are you for or against approval by the Netherlands of the treaty establishing a constitution for Europe?" (Is that right, spillher?)

Both seem pretty clear to me, but no, Mr Juncker - current president of the EU and Prime Minister of Luxembourg, a country right next to France and not far from Holland - is claiming the people didn't vote the way that they did. Whether you are for the European Union or against it, is that the sort of politician you want in power - one who refuses to take not one but two national referendums seriously?

And on top of that we have the French saying that they want the EU to stop paying Britain's rebate, which was created to offset the fact that we get very little back in terms of agricultural subsidy, yet are utterly unwilling to make any concessions with regards to the disproportionate amount of such subsidies that go to their farmers. France isn't a poor Eastern European country, it's just one that refuses to reform its industry and is happier for others to subsidise it.

Why do we do all this? It seems like a tremendous waste of cash and a source of limitless antagonism, over someone's impractical utopian dream.

Comments

[lost-in-moose.livejournal.com]

I'm rushing out now so just a quick post.

Why would the EU want to centralise and homogenise it's laws/taxes/forces etc when it's greatest asset is the diversity of it's member nations.

Besides which the statement that you can't please all the people all of the time is especially applicable here. The USA works because it is one nation with essentially one people, where the USA totally and utterly fails is in dealing with those who do not conform rigidly to it's system. More to the point though, the USA has different levels to it's legal system, it's uppermost legal scheme is fairly lightweight and the principle bulk of it's laws are implemented/decided at the state level. What the EU proposes doing isn't even something as sensible as that.

I think that government should go the "other" way, rather than centralising it's needs to decentralise so that it can better fit the people.

The economic benefits of being within the EU trading block are very clear cut and so this can be used as a bludgeon to bring in nations that would otherwise be unacceptable. For example i'm personally opposed to Turkey being in the EU due to it's absolutely horrific human rights record, but by forcing them to reach certain standards in specific areas (like human rights etc) the EU could have then offered them entry into it. In the end the whole issue of Turkey and the EU is outside the scope of this and i'm off into town. Laters!

[soldatengrab.livejournal.com]

ill agree with you, but come from a different angle, America works on two levels, the state level, and the federal level. Most decisions, yes, never go to the federal level, as is the way with europe, and each state has its own laws, so how is this different from europe.

Ethnic diversity is a wonderful thing, and there is no way in hell that any language is going to become the sole European language, we are a diverse continent, this is never going to change. Government should centralise, but yes, in a way that the Union can veto any specific cases, as it does in several areas as it is.

I'm opposed to Turkey being in the EU for several reasons (and feel free to hit me with the right wing pillow), firstly, Europe, as america, is diverse sure, but is largely white, european, and christian, this we all agree on, and as such we hold certain values and ideals. An islamic nation, of a different ethnic build would really upset the balance of power. Secondly, turkey has been told time and time again, leave cyprus, and you can join the EU, you invaded cyprus, you are not allowed there. let cyprus be. Turkey said no. The eu said ok, well, remove the death penalty, and promise to leave cyprus SOMETIME in the future. Turkey still said no. The Eu then turned round and said, ok, well how about we compromise. To me politics, as we see with britain and france, is all about who is most stubborn, as they will get their way in the end.

[bedlamborn.livejournal.com]

And Turkey does not lie in Europe. Another way to say no to them. And as long they continues to occupy northern cyprus there should be no chance of them entering EU.

[lost-in-moose.livejournal.com]

Well i disagree with your reasons, for one thing i dont think it matters about the race thing, lets face it Britain is only nominally if at all majority white and i'm personally an Atheist so the religion aspect can go.

besides which its precisely because we're such a mono-culture that we risk becoming insular and ignorant.

I dont want us to be another USA, the US isn't the greatest example of everything on Earth, they do some stuff well but to be honest they have the fabulous advantage that their enormous environment bestows on them.

If we're looking for examples of ways of doing things then for any specific thing like education, hospital/medicine, police, or just the general way we'd like our society to grow and behave then can we please stop fawning ovr the US?